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New Poll Shows Support for Mass Transit Referendum in Marion County

Indy’s Congregation Action Network commissioned a poll for the upcoming Mass Transit referendum. The results are encouraging to supporters, however I’m going to take this with a grain of salt. This is an organization that supports transit, and not an independent media source. Still, I figured it would be good to link it here in case anyone was curious to see a potential reading of the November electorate. Without some independent polls, though, we can’t average out the results to find a better gauge.

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32 Responses to “ “New Poll Shows Support for Mass Transit Referendum in Marion County”

  1. ahow628 says:

    Fantastic news! Hopefully it passes!

  2. John M says:

    I agree that a poll like this should be treated with some skepticism given the source, but if this was a truly scientific poll then it’s fair to presume that the referendum is winning, even if not necessarily by 43 percent.

  3. Andy says:

    While I’m sure the questions were worded in a manner in which to elicit positive responses, the numbers are still promising even under that lens. Definitely good news for supporters of the measure.

  4. LastBoyScout says:

    The results of this poll are great news. I hope they are accurate.

    That said, it seems that the most vocal group opposing the Mass Transit referendum is the anonymous group in SoBro. The ironic thing is that members (presumably members – they’re anonymous after all) say that they support increased funding for better mass transit. Then they turn around and say that they oppose the Mass Transit referendum because of the Red Line.

    It’s a maddening contradiction.

    • T says:

      they call south broadripple sobro? ugh… that’s like south broadway in louisville…. and both uses are terrible.

    • Robert Evans, III says:

      Anonymous? How can we be anonymous as we meet with and engage planners regularly? I actually just came back from another neighborhood meeting where most of the area is skeptical of the plan, supporting their concerns. There are eight of us on the core steering committee and are backed by a growing number of supporters to defeat this plan. Yes it is possible to support improving transit in this city and oppose THIS particular plan.

      Most of us live in Broad Ripple or Meridian Kessler. Any reference to “SoBro” may come from the number of business and restaurants along College Ave whose owners have spoken out pubiclly against it. We may lose but we are most definitely not in hiding. If you want to meet us, just ask.

      • Robert Evans, III says:

        I would really love to see the methodology. I wonder where they got the sample from or how big it was considering no one I know was asked.

  5. Andy says:

    Eh, the dueling Red Line petitions was won by the pro-side. Seems that this is being won by the pro-side as well. Seems people like both BRT as well as improved standard IndyGo service. We’ll see come November.

  6. Newbie says:

    If the organization that sponsored the survey made public the methodology and the full set of questions, then it would be possible to judge the credibility of the results. As someone who has designed and conducted public opinion research projects throughout the country, I can attest to (a) the need for a large enough sample size to make the results representative of the general population within a +/- error margin of 3 percent or less, (b) random computer dialing of prospective responsdents to avoid bias, and (c) neutrally-phrased closed-end questions (agree, disagree, don’t know, etc.) that are short, easy to understand, and do not lead the respondent to a desired response. No survey results should ever be published without have this kind of information available.

    • Robert Evans, III says:

      Here here! Well put Newbie! Jolly well stated!

      Especially given that we, the opposition, are paying for this out of our pockets and don’t have the resources or time to create our own survey.

  7. Natacha says:

    Why do you remove non profane and logical comments that are inconsistent with your philosophy? I mean, is this a blog or an op ed seeking affirmation?

    • That’s not the problem, it’s that I can no longer welcome your comments here any more. The battles are tiresome and are obviously not going to get anywhere. As I keep saying, feel free to comment on your own website.

    • sjudge says:

      That would be Steve’s website, Karen – collegeaveindy decided it wasn’t going to allow comments long time ago

      • LastBoyScout says:

        CollegeAveIndy does not appear to be updating their site any longer. At least they mostly fixed their atrocious formatting (I was a big fan of their early work!).

        It used the be the best anonymous community group. Just terrific. No more. Sad!

        • Stan-O says:

          You people just don’t get it!!1! I have experience with both the wonderful intellectuals with CollegeAvenueIndy as well as the proletariat-loving commies with TWG, IndyGo and Milhaus. Just the other day I was frequenting my local watering hole and ran into several representatives for IndyGo and Milhaus while TWG people sadly drank scotch in the corner – lamenting their failed bid to ruin our neighborhood! I spoke with them about the RedLine for several hours, which they said had to be off the record – I DON”T THINK SO PINKO!!! They told me that there had been no studies done with respect to the Red Line, NOT A SINGLE ONE! All they mentioned were things like “economic impact surveys” and “environmental effect tests.” NOT ONE THING CALLED A STUDY!~!!! Of course they told me that they know this will bleed our wonderful city dry and increase crime in Midtown (they’re word, not mine, I’ll never call Meridian Kessler midtown – ugh, sounds like commoners would live there) but that was they’re PLAN ALL ALoNG!!1! As I was leaving I picked up their considerable tab with the parting words “since you probably would expect the taxpayers to pay this, I’ll just do it myself!” LOLz!!!!!

          • Paul says:

            Keep fighting the good fight Stan.

          • AE says:

            Stan, next time don’t post comments right after leaving your local watering hole. It’s bad for your grammar and logic.

          • sjudge says:

            He made almost the same post about a year ago.

          • Stan-O says:

            I don’t think that
            Any of you understand the
            Magnitude of what is
            About
            To happen to our
            Regal neighborhood
            Once this
            Logistically impossible
            Log jam is instituted

          • Chris Brown says:

            Stan, hopefully you are trying to perform a parody of an irrational poster. If not, you need to consider speaking with a mental health professional. First, your whole alleged encounter with IndyGo representatives is so obviously a fabricated story that it is laughable. Obviously, no representative would say any of the comments you claim they made either on or off the record.

            Second, neither you nor any opponent of the Red Line has bee able to logically explain how improved bus service would harm the neighborhood, reduce property values, or increase crime. I have read these ludicrous allegations, but I have never read a rational and logical explanation as to how improved bus service could have ant of these ill effects.

            If you want to look like a crazy person that should be locked up keep posting your nonsense. If you want to be taken seriously, then post logical, well-reasoned and truthful arguments about why you oppose the Red Line.

  8. sjudge says:

    and Stan will stop picking up fictitious tabs for fictitious people?

  9. Robert Evans says:

    Reducing the amount of parking on the street in front of single residence homes, increasing congestion at rush hour, blocking entrances to drive ways from both directions at all times will by some estimates decrease property values along College.

    I have two friends that have passed on purchases in the neighborhood because of the Red Line. One because they understood that the parking in front of the home would no longer be there and the second because they were off of Broadway and 53rd and and see how the parking is taken up with patrons from 54th and College restaurants. I also know one seller around 50th and College that has had people pass on buying their home because of it.

    I guess we will see.

    • Chris says:

      All these homes have driveways and garages. Why would anyone park in front of their home, unless they were having a party? And, I think most people who want to live in an urban neighborhood that will have good public transit could care less about street parking when they have a driveway and garage. (Not to mention, 90% of the street parking will remain). And, I do not see anything in the proposal that would block anyone’s driveway. A bus running down the street would block a driveway? It does not work that way in any other city with a rapid bus system, so why would Indianapolis be different?

      No offense intended, but if your friends really passed on home purchases for the reasons you stated, they sound pretty clueless and irrational. But, to each his own.

      Again, I have yet to read any plausible and logical explanation as to how the Red Lime would supposedly reduce property values.

      • sjudge says:

        No small part of it is the condition of the alleys. When the City put alley maintenance on the far back burner, they deteriorated. As part of the neighborhood association, we’ve done alley clean ups for the fifteen years I’ve been involved, and even doing a basic drive through to assess what we were going to need to accomplish has been treacherous. Trash pick up in alleys stopped mostly because the rucks could no longer navigate them, and disuse has lead to overgrowth and narrowing. If your garage access is via the alley, you stop using the garage. We’ve been advocating, at least along the alleys abutting College, for some funding to deal with that – there’s going to be funding for sidewalks to get passengers to College, but there’s no clear message about whether there will be funds for the alleys.

        I agree that transit along College won’t in any way devalue properties along transit routes, or that the loss of parking will prove substantial enough a problem to harm businesses, but it will increase parking along the abutting streets.

      • Robert Evans says:

        Ever heard of a household with more than one so people park on the street? Case in point we have 4 cars in our home, two are regularly parked in the street, sometimes three depending on schedules. A lot of the homes on College do not have garages. Want I meant by blocking the drive is that if you are going north and you live on the west side of the street you have to turn around vs driving directly in.

        The ‘urban neighborhood’ label is where this debate goes wrong. It’s really not, or it is, depending on your viewpoint. Some people, myself included, dispise congestion. It is not irrational to want to be able to regularly park in front of your home. I have heard from realtors that it will improve property values. I also know that some people been appraised at lower values. We shall see.

        • Paul says:

          If you despise congestion then why do you support a policy where the city basically subsidizes as much space as anyone would ever need to park as many cars as they can? Looks at the suburbs, that is where Indy true traffic mess lies. Where did all that planning for auto congestion get them? Oh yeah, exactly what they planned for: congestion.

          Urban neighborhood or not MK is not a modern suburb. Zoning laws were created after most of the plats and development had been laid out. People talk about it like the places with homes should be treated like a Fisher’s subdivision where nothing can be changed and definitely no apartments or businesses. But this isn’t the reality on the ground. It is a wide ranging “neighborhood” with artificially drawn borders. Parts like College Ave can be a different place from New Jersey but people harp on the fact that College falls under MK jurisdiction to enforce conformity. It also has a long history of mass transit on College and the built form reflects this.

        • Chris says:

          Yes, I have heard of a household where there is more than one car, and it would be my own. We have two cars and they both go in the garage.
          I understand that some households have more than 2 cars, though as the younger generation becomes less and less interested in driving having several cars will become less and less common. Ever heard of a famous company called GM that recently made a quiet offer (that was refused) to purchase the car-service Lyft? Why exactly would GM do that? I believe because they see the writing on the wall with the reduction in people driving and the advent of self-driving cars. More people will take public transit, and opt for car services (with self-driving cars) to fill in the gaps.

          Also, as I said, approximately 90% of the on-street parking spaces will remain. So, for households such as yours with 4 cars, you would still have the option to park on the street. Likely, you would still be able to park right-in-front of your house, but for the homes that would lose their on-street parking, it is no real inconvenience. A public street belongs to everyone, you are not required to park immediately in front of your house, and parking one or two spaces down is no big deal.

          Also, I think by “turn-around” you mean flipping around because of the median? If that is what you mean, it is not really a big inconvenience to turn-around. It may add a minute to your drive, which in the scheme of things is not a big deal.

          As for congestion, any successful neighborhood should have a certain level of congestion, as the opposite of congestion is emptiness, which means no one wants to live or shop in the neighborhood, and this is a very bad thing. What most of us do not want is excessive congestion. To the extent we can get more people out of their cars, it does help reduce excessive congestion.

          Finally, yes, I guess we shall see. My bet is that there are more people who want to live in an urban neighborhood with good public transit than there are people worried about being able to park their 2 extra cars directly in front of their home. I agree that people should have options, and the option you have if you really want to live in a neighborhood designed totally around cars is to move to an old-fashioned far-out suburb (I say old-fashioned, since the trend in newer suburban development is to move away from car-centric focus). But, I think for the handful of people who move out or pass-up moving in for that reason, there will be 10 times as many people glad to move in.

  10. EFK says:

    From MIBOR and the Indy Chamber on 8-29-16:
    INDIANAPOLIS—Poll results released today shows broad-based support across Marion County registered voters for this fall’s ballot initiative to improve mass transit in Indianapolis. Following last week’s public rollout of the grassroots initiative, Transit Drives Indy, there is clear momentum and public support for the Marion County Transit Plan.
    As American Strategies reported, “Fully 61 percent support the referendum, which will appear on the ballot this November, with just 33 percent opposed. The measure attracts bipartisan support and majority backing in each region of the county.”
    Supporters self-identified as democrats (74%), independents (55%), and republicans (47%). Across the region, support was strongest in the northern (66%) and central (62%) parts of the county, though support was strong across the entire county.
    “We are pleased with the broad support among Marion County residents who recognize the value that improved transit service will bring to our neighborhoods, our business community and our city—jobs, quality of life, and greater independence,” said Mark Fisher, vice president of government relations and policy development of the Indy Chamber. “The Marion County Transit Plan will better connect job seekers and employers while ensuring Indianapolis remains competitive for talent.”
    “Coming on the heels of last week’s Transit Drives Indy rollout, the energy behind the transit movement continues to grow and gain momentum,” said Roger Lundy, president of MIBOR REALTOR® Association. “Marion County residents and the central Indiana region as a whole benefits from improved mass transit, providing the key to connecting neighborhoods, providing access to more housing opportunities and enabling independence for vulnerable populations.”

    • Robert Evans says:

      You do realize that American Strategies is a PR consulting firm don’t you? It was hired by organizers to produce these types of polls. Ever heard of selection bias in polling? Not exactly something you can place in the “trusted source” category.

      • EFK says:

        American Strategies has been around a long time, and surely wouldn’t have made it this far if they produced biased polls. Instead, if the poll results had been unfavorable to transit, I doubt we would have seen any announcement about them.

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